Text and/or other creative content from this version of Tram was copied or moved into Trams in popular culture with this edit on 11 June 2020 19:28 (UTC). The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists.
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This article is waaay too long. Perhaps we could consider moving sections to new articles (which I've done for the "Design" section) and providing a summary in their place, or removing information that is already present in existing articles. There are two things we could do:
The history section should be checked to see if it shares the same information as the History of Trams article, and vice versa. If there are differences in the two articles, the differences should be merged into the History of Trams article and a summary left instead in the "History" section of the main Trams article (this one).
The lists of trams systems and statistics should similarly be checked for differences and be merged with their respective main articles. Similarly a summary should also be provided.
Late here, but I agree. I read the History of Trams articles and there are so many similarities. Not to mention, there are practically no sources on this very long article - I found 3 pages and several other sections with absolutely 0 sources! ChillyDude153198 (talk) 01:32, 21 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The article states that the Melbourne tram system is "generally recognised as one of the largest in the world". This is not true, it is generally recognised as THE largest system in the world. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.45.209.198 (talk) 13:24, 21 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
There is the list headed "Other large transit networks that operate streetcar and light rail systems include". At least for some of them, I wonder what the "light rail systems" included are. This is true for example for Leipzig, which has classic tramways and railway trains, and nothing else. Perhaps the S-Bahn is included here, but that is definitely heavy rail (legally, an S-Bahn train is a railway train like any other in Germany). Plus if S-Bahn is included, cities like Berlin should show up as well. The list contains Riga, but in Riga there are trams and railways (and trolleybuses, but these can't count as "light rail", since they have no rails). The railways, being broad gauge, are actually pretty heavy, nobody would describe them as "light rail". The same is true for Iasi (not broad gauge, but still nothing resembling light rail in Iasi). So many inclusions in this list seem dubious.91.125.192.100 (talk) 21:36, 11 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]
There are proportionally far more advantages than sources, and far more advantages than disadvantages. However, the amount of sourced advantages and disadvantages seems very similar. This brings factual accuracy of the section in to question. There are several points that are unsourced and expansions on points that are not verified by the sources.
In addition, there are some points I find to be debatable when met with no source: "Being guided by rails means that even very long tram units can navigate tight, winding city streets that are inaccessible to long buses." While it's true that long busses cannot navigate tight corners, many modern trams have a pretty limiting upper value on track curvature. What I'm trying to say, to clarify, is that the points are simply not reliable. ChillyDude153198 (talk) 00:22, 21 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm kind of inclined to chop the debate section entirely (as I did to the excessive list of global examples of systems which was simply an inferior version of List of tram and light rail transit systems). We are an encyclopedia, not a debate team. Benefits and drawbacks should be integrated neatly into the article's prose. Unfortunately, the sourcing currently is poor in this section so doing this is not easy. I consider deleting the whole section in question more controversial than my previous edit which I did boldly, so looking for others' thoughts on the matter. Trainsandotherthings (talk) 21:45, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's nice to include some images that are important for readers to understand a heading.... but 40 images??? Goodness. Tennis Project has a limit of 10. Sure a superstar like Federer or Serena might have 11 or 12 and no one is going to argue, but 40 images really detracts from the subject matter. This isn't a 400 page book on the history of the tram, this is a concise short summary of what a tram is. It's overloaded on historical tram pics, maps of tram lines, silly things like signs in Portland, etc... We have articles like Trams in Melbourne to be more thorough. I'm not saying you have to follow Tennis Project with their 10 pic limit, but this should easily be able to be cut in half to 20 pics. Reading this article I still don't know what the definition of a tram is. Lightrail and subway systems in the US are called just that. Trams, streetcars, and trolleys are a totally different subset. San Francisco has light-rail (Bart) and also has trollies or street cars. They are not the same things. It seems like this subject could be split into two separate articles so readers understand that fact. Fyunck(click) (talk) 22:52, 24 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It used to be 50 images before I took a chainsaw to the article earlier this month. But I agree, this article needs significant cutting of images still. It is still messy and unfocused. Trainsandotherthings (talk) 00:19, 25 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well, "a picture paints a thousand words" so images are very useful. Instead of simply deleting them; how about uncluttering the mess and replace image with a better focus on the existing text? KatVanHuis (talk) 08:39, 25 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
There was no world in which fifty images were appropriate for this article. A number were simply not right to use here period. When you have images running off the end of the page and on top of each other, there is a problem. Image selection should be about quality, not trying to jam as many images as possible into an article. But what has happened here over the years is people adding images with zero regard for if they fit where they are placed, if they illustrate anything new, or if there is even room in the article without causing problems. I disagree with your reflexive attitude that images cannot be removed. Some might be replaced by better images, sure, but the total number is excessive for the length of this article. Trainsandotherthings (talk) 21:41, 25 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You'll notice that unlike in this article, the images are arranged well and there is white space in the article. In this article, the images are everywhere to the point there's very little white space. Trainsandotherthings (talk) 21:42, 25 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Also the biggest problem with that article is the clump of pics for greatest male and greatest female players. No sure who added those but they need to go. I'll fix it in the next few days. Fyunck(click) (talk) 22:15, 25 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]